TOPIC:

William Murray Caldwell Greaves Bagshawe (1864-1901)

The Greaves & Bagshawe were often hyphenated and he seems to have had a preference for being known as Murray rather than William.

William/Murray was born on the 19th October 1864 at Ford Hall, Chapel-en-le-Frith, Derbyshire.



landedfamilies.blogspot.com/2017/12/314-...hall-and-banner.html

The link above takes you to the source of the above photograph and several others of Ford Hall plus a lot of information about the land-owning Bagshawe family. Murray’s father, William Henry Greaves-Bagshawe (1831-1913) occupies a whole section and includes this regarding William/Murray:

“William Murray Caldwell Greaves-Bagshawe (1864-1901), born 19 October 1864 and baptised at Chapel-en-le-Frith, 16 January 1865; educated at Market Rasen (Lincs) and Trinity College, Cambridge; JP and DL for Derbyshire; an officer in Derbyshire Yeomanry (Lt.), who served in the Boer War; married 1st, 23 August 1888 at Rusholme (Lancs), Marie Louise (c.1865-91), only child of J.G. Silkenstadt of Rose Bank, Didsbury (Lancs) and 2nd, 25 July 1894 at St James, Piccadilly, Westminster (Middx), Lilian Florence (b. 1868) (who m2, 8 December 1904 in Bombay (India), Lt-Col. Oliver Carleton Armstrong DSO (1859-1932), son of Maj. W.C. Armstrong, and had issue), daughter of Edward Madoc-Jones of Glentworth, Oswestry (Shropshire), but had no issue; died in the lifetime of his father when he was drowned off the coast of Madagascar while returning from the Boer War, 20 May 1901; will proved 13 May 1902 (estate £2,060).”

W M C G Bagshawe (and variations thereon) received numerous mentions in the British Newspapers of 1901 & 1902 which allow the following timeline to be established:

27th January 1900 – The Derbyshire Imperial Yeomanry consisting of six officers, 116 men & 82 horses embarked on the Cavour at Liverpool and set sail for South Africa. Amongst the officers was a Lieutenant Bagshawe (recently promoted from Second Lieutenant).

20th August 1900 – The residents of Chapel-en-le-Frith gave Mr Murray Greaves-Bagshawe a “hearty welcome” on his arrival home from South Africa. “Whilst on active service he had his horse shot from under him, and since then he has sustained serious injuries to one knee by falling from his horse on the battlefield, rendering him unfit for further service. . . . . . . Mr Bagshawe, who walked lame, but is otherwise looking well, thanked the inhabitants for their hearty and sympathetic reception”.

26th November 1900 – Mr Murray Greaves-Bagshawe of Ford Hall addressed those attending the annual meeting of the local branch of the St John’s Ambulance Association in Chapel-en-le-Frith Town Hall on the war in South Africa. The report is long but interesting in content and I will transcribe and post it in due course.

3rd February 1901 – Lieutenant Murray Bagshawe wearing the uniform of the “Derbyshire Yeomanry” attended a memorial service in Chapel-en-le-Frith Parish Church. The article does not elaborate on what the memorial service was in aid of.

19th February 1901 – The Sheffield Telegraph contained the following paragraph: “Mr Murray G J Bagshawe, of Ford Hall, has again left to join the Derbyshire Yeomanry for South Africa. Lieutenant Bagshawe returned home wounded a few months ago after being on active service.” I can find no evidence that he did rejoin the Derbyshire IY in south Africa and he does not appear to have been awarded the “South Africa 1901” QSAM clasp

From July 1901 to September 1901 the number of mentions increased dramatically with articles concerning the mysterious death of Mr Murray Bagshawe. Making sense of them is a bit of a challenge. Two published at the start of July claimed he had actually left England previously to go on a Mediterranean cruise to help recover his health and the news that he had apparently fallen overboard from a German ship bound for Durban came as a surprise. At the time the ship was anchored in Majunga Harbour, Madagascar and one evening he had dined with the other passengers as usual but had not turned up for breakfast the next day. At first it was assumed he had gone ashore by small boat until it was realised his bed had not been slept in and all his possessions were still in his cabin. By early September hope had been given up of him resurfacing (pun intended) and it was reported that the family were “daily expecting to receive his luggage”.

There does not seem to have been an inquest and his 13th May 1902 London Probate states he “died 20th May 1901 at sea". His effects were valued at £2,060 4s.

A search of Find-a-Grave produced the following memorial tablet allegedly located in the churchyard of St Thomas A’Beckett Church, Chapel-en-le-Frith.




Personally I think on the night of 20th May 1901 he was either the worse for drink or he committed suicide. Of course in 1901 it would have been awfully bad form to suggest either, unless there was definite proof to support either hypothesis. The other possibility, based on the 1905 report (see original post), is that he ran away with two Canadian Ladies but as none of the reports of his death I found mentioned missing Canadian Ladies I dismiss such a notion out of hand.

Good morning David,
Your post is a gold mine of info and I can’t thank you enough. I had some of the info via the newspapers, but not nearly as much as you and you’ve filled in a lot of blanks. Bagshawe’s life i has its complexities. Married, widowed and married again; South Africa and being hurt/wounded, convalescing and then his disappearance, which seems most likely due to his death rather than running off with a couple of Canadian women. But was it an accident, suicide, perhaps even something more sinister? We’ll never know. I wonder what the ships logs had written in them? The Bagshawe family papers exist and appear to be available. I’ll have to check that out. What I find odd is that there are no photos of him and he was rather prominent. He won a lot of competitions as a member of the English Eight rifle squad around the turn of the century. I can’t find photos of his wives either not there graves… there’s obviously much more to research. Thank you again for your kind assistance and help. Like you, I find the person behind the medals the primary reason for the hobby.
All the very best, John

John - you have probably already seen this but just in case:

history919.wordpress.com/2012/09/02/two-...agedy-and-a-mystery/

Googling the name of his first wife is productive but surprisingly does not produce a photo of her - might be worth contacting Manchester Archives, and Derbyshire Archives for a photo of William/Murray although I would hope the family papers contain one.

Your QSA could be described as ordinary as QSA's go but learning about the people associated with it makes it rather special.

All the best, David.

PS Happy to email you all the newspaper clippings I have downloaded if you provide me with your email address via the site private message service. One of them does mention he was one of the best shots in the land and had done well at Bisley. Just started transcribing his thoughts on the war in SA.

From the Derby Mercury of 28th November 1900.

MR MURRAY BAGSHAWE, J. P., ON HIS WAR EXPERIENCES.

Mr Murray C. Greaves-Bagshawe, J. P., of Ford Hall, Chapel-en-le-Frith, who recently returned home from South Africa, where he had served with the Derbyshire Yeomanry until incapacitated by a fall from his horse, met with a splendid reception at a crowded meeting in the Chapel-en-le-Frith Town Hall on Monday evening, when he presided over the annual meeting of the local branch of the St. John’s Ambulance Association. Mr Bagshawe, in response to a vote of thanks, said he thanked them very sincerely for the very kind and hearty welcome they had given him. It had been a very great war. It had been going on a long time, and he was afraid it would yet be a very long time before it was brought to a satisfactory conclusion. Yet the bulk of the work had been done, and it had been done well, in spite of whatever critics might say to the contrary (Hear, hear). Englishmen were distinguished for their love of fair play, and he should like them to see fair play for our generals in the war, who had done so well; and as to the regimental officers, the war had brought out their very fine talent and British pluck. The finest thing in his experience was the conduct of the 2nd Grenadier Guards at the battle of Biggarsburg, for they went in and came out of that terrible fight exactly as if it had been a field day at Aldershot (Cheers). In one section of 50 men only one man came out of the ordeal, and he had half a dozen bullets in his clothing, but was not injured. It was a grand thing to see what Englishmen could do under these circumstances, and whatever critics might say to the contrary, our fellows had done exceedingly well – certainly nobody could have done better (Hear, hear). He was proud to belong to the Derbyshire Yeomanry, who had done their duty. He felt, and felt strongly , that the Army Medical Corps had not had a fair chance. Out of 121 officers and men, there were at the time he (Mr Bagshawe) left to return home only 70 men in the regiment, and only 48 on parade, which meant that not half of the total number were actual casualties in action, as a very large number had died or been left behind in different hospitals suffering from enteric fever and other diseases. He should never forget a march of nearly 350 miles under the most trying conditions. The water was exceedingly bad, and had to be boiled before it was fit to touch, but many of the poor fellows were unable to boil it because they had not the opportunity to do so. In his experience of the Army Medical Corps he came across doctors of all kinds, some of whom were getting two thousand pounds a year from their practice at home, but who had gone out there for the love of their country; and although before he went out he (speaker) had not a very high opinion of the Army Medical Corps he was satisfied from experience they were very fine fellows, and they did their duty; and that although Mr Burdet-Coutts and others had been tarring them all with the same brush he (the speaker) knew of only about three instances in which perhaps they might have done better. In human nature we were not all arch-angels of the first rank, and he did not like to hear those who were serving their country abroad blackguarded by people who sitting in their armchairs at home (Applause).

My notes/comments:

“Englishmen” & “Englishmen” – it is almost enough to make me consider voting Plaid Cymru in the next general election. I notice this frequently in articles contemporary to the ABW but in this case I do have acknowledge one use of the word “British”.

“Battle of Biggarsburg”? I presume it should be Biggarsberg which seems to lie about 35 miles NE of Ladysmith. The 2nd Grenadier Guards did not arrive in South Africa until 11th April 1900, which leaves me lost identifying this alleged battle. Was the Speaking talking rubbish?

121 reduced to 48 fighting fit in 6 months in South Africa! Actually this accords well with other accounts I have read. If the Imperial Forces had coped better at avoiding disease with more vaccination and better provision of potable water I wonder how long the war would have lasted and how much the overall bill could have been reduced by? The downside would have been there would have been less medals handed out for modern day collectors to collect.