TOPIC:

Susie,

Frank makes a good point that the 5 bars mentioned could be 5 in total - 3 on the QSA Medal and 2 on the KSA Medal. Frank also narrows down our men to 4474 Cpl F Clarke.

Your information states that your Great Grandfather was a POW - 4474 Cpl F Clarke was not. Here is a list of all of the Clarke's who served with the Suffolk Regiment during the Boer War and what happened to them (Cross referenced between the QSA and KSA Medal Rolls and the Regimental Journal. There are two F Clarke's and one J Clarke.

2203 Pte F Clarke served with the 8th Mounted Infantry, only received the QSA Medal and was not a POW.
4474 Cpl F Clarke served with the Regiment, received the QSA and KSA Medals, but as stated above was not a POW.
2692 Pte J Clark served with the Regiment, received the QSA and KSA Medals and WAS a POW, but we know from Frank's earlier post that he was too young to be your Great Grandfather and was born in Suffolk.

As Frank and I have both said, unfortunately further investigation is still required. Maybe more of these Clarke's are also members of your family?

Kind regards

Ian

Hello Iain,
Can I ask how you know that Corporal Clarke was not a prisoner of war?
Regards Frank

Ians1900 wrote: Susie,

Frank makes a good point that the 5 bars mentioned could be 5 in total - 3 on the QSA Medal and 2 on the KSA Medal. Frank also narrows down our men to 4474 Cpl F Clarke.

Your information states that your Great Grandfather was a POW - 4474 Cpl F Clarke was not. Here is a list of all of the Clarke's who served with the Suffolk Regiment during the Boer War and what happened to them (Cross referenced between the QSA and KSA Medal Rolls and the Regimental Journal. There are two F Clarke's and one J Clarke.

2203 Pte F Clarke served with the 8th Mounted Infantry, only received the QSA Medal and was not a POW.
4474 Cpl F Clarke served with the Regiment, received the QSA and KSA Medals, but as stated above was not a POW.
2692 Pte J Clark served with the Regiment, received the QSA and KSA Medals and WAS a POW, but we know from Frank's earlier post that he was too young to be your Great Grandfather and was born in Suffolk.

As Frank and I have both said, unfortunately further investigation is still required. Maybe more of these Clarke's are also members of your family?

Kind regards

Ian

Hi Frank,

Well, firstly I happen to have the pages from the Suffolk Regt Journal relating to the Colesberg Operations, which are very specific and he isn't mentioned there. I also have a copy of the South African Field Force Casualty Returns and he isn't mentioned there either. Finally, I looked at the information David provided on this website regarding prisoners released from Watervaal, Nootegedacht and Barberton and he isn't there either.

I know that singularly none of these sources are 100% foolproof, but I would find it hard to believe that Cpl Clarke would have been omitted from everything.

Of course a look at his service papers is recommended, as they will always be the best source of information.

What do you think about the 12 months in captivity? I certainly haven't come across that before.

Also, the newspaper article mentions three South African medals; what do you think that could be? Kimberley Star perhaps? If so not a Suffolk Regt infantryman. I still wonder about Mounted Infantry being a possibility.

Sometimes this is easy, but not this one!

Kind regards
Ian

Hello Ian,
The casualties shown in the press and many publications tend to come from the War Office returns and often have errors and omissions, but, then those returns themselves have the same, on occasion, so if a man is missing from those, he is unlikely to be shown elsewhere, being captured is not often shown in service papers at this point in time, so I always keep an open mind
I don't think the newspaper is entirely correct, although, certain aspects of it, well perhaps, the best thing for Susie to do is find those medals!
Regards Frank

Dear Ian and Frank,

Thank you for all your comments I am attaching a couple of photographs - not sure if these will help. The one where he is wearing his medals may not be a good enough resolution to see any detail - I'll try and get a better copy. The family group would have been taken around 1917.

As for the medals, I am afraid that due to a rather unfortunate family feud at the time of Frederick's death the medals are no longer available to me (families!!).

I'm visiting family at the moment so over the next few days I will find out as much as I can from folk to see if there is anything else that they can help with. But it would seem that Frederick didn't like talking about the war, so the best information we have is the newspaper article, but that could so easily have been exaggerated.

Best wishes for now,

Susie

Here you go Susie.....

Mike